If Men And Women Are Equal, Howcome I Can’t Take Off My Shirt?

To those who claim that men and women are “already” equal, I pose this query: Why can’t I take my shirt off on a hot, summer day? Seems a perfectly rational question; however, some people launch themselves straight into lunatic ravings and bug-eyed convulsions when posed with this particular dilemma. Why? Well, it’s the same old reason every time: questioning gender roles is oftentimes like questioning someone’s religious beliefs. It’s just too uncomfortable for some people. Boys are blue, girls are pink. Boys are tough, girls are weak. Boys are hunters, girls are moms. That’s how it’s always been. That’s how it has to be, or we’ll all explode.

Today, we will discuss the most common arguments against female toplessness. (If you have any arguments against female toplessness to add, please feel free to put them in the comments section and I will answer to them.)

1. Female breasts are sexual; male breasts are not.

Obviously, this is a fallacious argument, as it is entirely dependent on whom you consult. As far as gay men and straight women are concerned, breasts are non-sexual (and sometimes utterly icky.) In addition to that, I’m sure most straight women and gay men would find a bare, male chest to hold similar seductive value (see picture left.) Tell me that ain’t a sexy pair of pillows.

2. If women walked around with their tits hanging out all the time, there would be all kinds of car accidents.

If a man was walking around topless, he wouldn’t be blamed for a car accident had by some poor woman; she’d be faulted for not paying attention. Please place the blame where it lies.

3. It’s immoral. What about modesty?

If your religion or beliefs prevents you from walking around topless, don’t do it. Next.

4. There would be more sexual assaults if women were walking around everywhere naked.

I’m sure the puritans were spewing the same crap when bikini bathing suits first came out. Does anyone realize what bathing suits used to look like? Well… they used to be actual dresses that covered a woman’s entire body, from head to toe. (Obviously, there wasn’t much swimming happening in those things.) However, if sexual assault were A) related to sexual interest and B) the victim’s fault, I would agree – but it’s neither. Men don’t lose control and attack women because they are wearing bikini tops – it doesn’t even happen routinely in strip clubs, where women are fully nude. Men are human too and able to control their sexual urges, just as women are. If a sexual assault occurs, it is due to the defective mentality of the perpetrator – NOT EVER the fault of the victim.

5. Women’s breasts won’t be as sexually interesting or powerful anymore if they become “equal” with men’s chests.

I beg to differ. It will become more routine to see them exposed, but they certainly won’t lose any of their charm. (See LEGAL male breasts, top.)

6. What about the children?

This is pretty much the last argument people make when they run out of things to say. Well, if everyone is concerned about the children, why aren’t they forcing men to cover their nipples as well? You’d think that female breasts would be more acceptable to be seen in the open, as they are utilized for feeding… and, if men and women are equal, what’s the difference between male and female breasts?

7. Women’s breasts “stick out.”

So do fat men’s breasts. But they never get arrested.

8. It’s just not realistic. It’ll just never happen. People aren’t ready for it. Old people would have heart attacks.

This is pointless, defeatist thinking. Period.

9. You can’t have everyone walking around naked! You don’t see guys with their dicks out, do you?

Genitals are sex organs. If breasts shouldn’t be exposed, then get men to cover them up. If they’re okay, then make it equal. That is all.

Anyone else got something to say? Say it! I want to hear from you!!

(BTW, the only organization I found when I searched for Topless Rights was this one: TERA. It is, of course, a Canadian organization. If anyone knows of any other ones – that aren’t headed up by crazies or just plain nudists – that promote EQUAL rights, not NAKED rights, please comment below and direct me to them! Thanks!)

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About GoddessBlue

I'm a pansexual socialist feminist and part-time Theist; I'm a tutor and freelance blogger/writer and mess around with fiction in my spare time. I also like to whore around and I have a tendency to spank people.

Posted on March 25, 2011, in Activism, Body Image, Gender, Roles, Sexuality, Uncategorized and tagged , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , , . Bookmark the permalink. 59 Comments.

  1. This post reminds me of a presentation I did 2 semesters ago about advertising. Just to let you know, other countries such Spain or Argentina find topless woman as something completely normal (I couldn´t add a pic to my reply, but I´ll e-mail you a picture from an Argentinean magazine kiosk Constanza n I used in that presentation)

    Regardless I know many ¨more evolved¨cultures see female toplesnees as something completely normal, that´s something I personally disagree with. Maybe it is because I come from a place with many moral clichés, but I just think it doesn´t feel right.

    I totally disagree with the fact that marketing uses female body (and now day´s male) just to advertise a product. Appealing to people´s sexual desire and manipulating it to make a profit seems imoral to me, and I see it as one of the causes of moral values declining in society(How can you teach a boy to respect a woman and then teach him that woman are selling hooks at the same time?)

    Becoming used to female toplesness would add alot to that issue…. Just an opinion… I think my point is rejected on your post anyway.

  2. Great post on an issue that doesn’t get much attention!

    Breasts are not inherently sexual. When we think of something “sexy” on women, things like stilettos, fishnets, and cleavage bearing bustiers come to mind more than bare, unadorned breasts. Maybe they’re sexualized because they’re so taboo (women being arrested for going topless). And if it’s not okay for women to be topless because it offends some people, well, flabby old guys with immensely hairy chests walking around in the summer time make me nauseous. Does that mean we can pass a law telling them to cover up? Even when their pecs are round enough to look like women’s breasts?

    Interestingly, I remember a story I saw about a person who made a snow sculpture in their front yard of that famous aphrodite statue that’s missing her arms. The neighbors got offended and demanded they cover up the nipple-less snow breasts (because children might see them!). They, not wanting to destroy their work, looped a bandeau and a sarong over it. The effect made it seem more like a bright swimsuit issue or sexy calendar girl than the imitation of a piece of classical art. The swimsuit and sarong made what had once been an innocuous snowman into something sexual– all your attention is drawn immediately to the covered up areas.

    Clothing has more sexual connotations than nudity, but you don’t see anyone clamoring to outlaw heels and miniskirts (well, maybe, but it’s not an active law). I don’t really think it’s about sex; it’s about women owning their bodies and that’s what people in power don’t like.

  3. Honestly. I don’t like it when males parade around shirtless either. It’s a little uncomfortable…for me. Especially if I don’t know them well. I’m not a fan of revealing clothing on women or skin-tight pants on men.

    I am coming from a Christian perspective here and I’m thinking about that verse that talks about not causing another “brother” to stumble. Do I think women (or men) should be solid head-to-toe covered? No. But I think some clothes easily draws eyes and minds to places they shouldn’t be. And it’s important that everyone, male and female, takes that into consideration when they are dressing.

    Just my two cents. I’m not an insane judge either. I worry about myself. Share my personal convictions, if asked, and leave it up to you to decide yours 🙂

    • What do you mean by “shouldn’t”
      I mean. I know what the word means but people shouldn’t dress revealingly because thinking sexy thoughts is wrong? Why? Because a book says so?

      • Yeah…. “shouldn’t” is a pretty subjective word. In *my* happy little universe, created by me, I think *everyone* should oblige their lustful desires as well as any other cravings they might have. I think my autobots on my make-believe planet *shouldn’t* ever get jealous, and there *should* be an orgy and an outrageously delicious gourmet feast every evening, as stated in my new book, “The Bibbly.” Say what you want about my book, but I consider it to be “divine.”

        Ok, I might be poking a little fun at religion here, but seriously… do you see my point? Anyone can believe in anything they like. However, the line must be drawn when restrictions are placed upon people’s personal freedoms based on that person or group’s demographic position in society.

  4. Women should take off their shirts.

  5. I like big tits let them flap!!!

  6. Show me your genitals, genitals! I like hot chicks that arnt affraid to show some bootay!!!

  7. Great post. Funny. Well written.
    I am sure you are aware that in NYC, women are allowed to be topless. But NYC is sort of it’s own country in my opinion. Gays are also humans here.
    Also, I think it would take away some of the obsession with breasts, not the charm, but the obsession. This is good. People work all week just to blow their hard earned money to see a pair of breasts, it’s sad.
    Lastly, how do you find the inspiration to continue writing this blog when you have to deal with (presumable) a lot of immature trolls and incredibly rude/stupid people? I have slowly had to delete most of my online persona because of this. The open line of communication to the idiots.

    Thanks for the post.
    And also

    • Trolls are American citizens too… oh yeah, and even non-American individuals are people who deserve the liberty to speak their mind, so I say “Freedom for all!” (unless you attempt to attack me personally. Then I will find you and torture you with nonstop Thomas the Train episodes until you crack.) And, besides, if I don’t speak up, who will? We must stand up for human rights and for equality, hopefully offering new perspective that open-minded readers are seeking.

  8. I really liked the article, and the very cool blog

  9. lol. It is no discrimination in this part. It is just because woman have boobs thats all. It is likem if a woman show off her boobs it would be like a man showing off his pennis. I dont think its appropriate. Women can be treated equally with men but there is certain restriction which I dont think would effect any woman daily life at all. I dont think this should be an issue at all. In fact americans or westerners women should be grateful to have so many rights for women. There are countries in which their women would die to have freedom like you all, so be thankful for that.

    • No. A woman showing off her boobs would be like a man showing off his boobs. A woman showing off her vagina would be like a man showing off his penis. And I am thankful for the rights I have… what does that have to do with wanting change?

    • A woman showing her chest is equal to a man showing his chest. A man showing his penis is equal to a woman showing her vagina. A woman showing her boobs is NOT equal to a man showing his penis. I have no idea why some people seem to think it is the same.

      Also, are you saying that even though Western women aren’t equal to men we should be grateful because at least we’re doing better than women in other countries?

  10. okay, i’m not sure if i’m spelling this right, double standard?
    also, male breasts are not considered sexual in western society, so therefore men are able to show them off. female breasts are considered sexual in western society, so therefore women are not able to show their breasts.
    there are double standards against women, and double standards against men. that’s just how it is in our society.
    we are so desensitised by male breasts that they have been considered a very non-sexual thing by our society. penises, vaginas and female breasts are rarely seen on a day to day basis, excluding the bedroom/bathroom, therefore causing them to become more taboo to show in public. so, a man showing his penis is the equivalent amount of “taboo” as a woman showing her breasts or vagina.
    don’t get me wrong, i think that women should be able to take off their shirts on a hot day if they desire, but society doesn’t allow it to happen, because there are so many double standards going both ways.
    for example, a man would get ostracised if he wore a skirt and high heels in public.
    I’m not a feminist or a masculinist, I’m a humanist.
    Thank you for your time,

    an informed 16 year old.

    • Being a “humanist” includes being a feminist, so, in fact, you *are* a feminist if you’re a humanist; all feminists are humanists and all humanists are feminists, by definition 🙂
      I’m definitely 100% with you about the necessity of change in terms of the social dictation of men’s apparel. It’s ridiculous to box people into roles and ignore their preferences as individuals. We must work to overturn these double standards and have conversations about these issues whenever we can!

    • I agree with you for the most part. However, a man wouldn’t get arrested for wearing a skirt and high heels in public as long as his penis isn’t showing. If that happened he’d be arrested for showing his genitals not for wearing a skirt.

  11. If women were legally allowed to take off their shirts I think this would cause more issues. Women may feel pressured to take off their shirts by other individuals who may or may not want to see them topless. I’m a dude and have been in situations such as going to super splash (before it got shut down).There was this long slide ride and they had a policy for the dudes to not wear shirt going down the slide.
    Psychologically it can have positive and negative effects, boost or lower self esteem. Women may be complemented or put down by others who view their breasts (All breasts are different, nipple, size, color etc…) As a result sexual harassment charges would most likely increase.
    There have been studies that suggest men are more visually stimulated. Seeing bare breasts attracts a lot of attention from sex offenders, drunks, druggies, and others who are abusive and would take advantage of women. I agree it’s not fair in my opinion I think it’s best for now.
    Side note: I apologize for any grammar and punctuation mistakes.

    • “If women were legally allowed to take off their shirts… women may feel pressured to take off their shirts by other individuals who may or may not want to see them topless.” You mean the way it is for men now? You mean like when women go, “C’mon, take off your shirt,” to guys? Or are you saying that women would automatically feel compelled to take off their shirt for no reason? I don’t see men randomly doing this and I don’t see how women would suddenly feel compelled to do this either. All I see is men taking off their shirt and not getting arrested for it.
      Yes, taking off your shirt can have positive or negative effects, but so can dressing sexy. Some people do it, some people don’t do it. The people who dress sexy are confident in the way they look; however, no matter what, a person might be insulted or sexually harassed when dressing sexy. This is already true and whether or not a person chooses to take off their shirt should be up to them, not up to the legal system.
      Sexual harassment is a law that prevents hostile environments in the workplace. I can’t even think of a workplace environment where people typically have their shirts off, except maybe outdoor painters/roofers/construction, in which case members of any sex are bound to get attention. Big whoop. Sexual harassment charges in general wouldn’t increase since the workplace is generally not an environment in which to take off your shirt in front of your boss. Workplace dress codes would still apply, as they do now for men as well.
      “There have been studies that suggest men are more visually stimulated.” You know who you’re talking to, right? Yes, and I have a vagina. This claim is unfounded by unbiased scientific proof and contradicted by several other studies. So, bullshit. Not to mention, I don’t see how any possible psychological differences between women and men should dictate a woman’s ability to take her shirt off in public without legal harassment or arrest. Next.
      Sex offenders, drunks and druggies pay unwanted attention to women anyway. Shirtless females would be at risk just as much as any LEGALLY provocatively clothed female.
      Finally, the fact that certain family-friendly venues have keep-your-shirt-on policies doesn’t factor into this conversation.

  12. There will never be complete equality, because men and women are physically different, and most likely psychologically different also. because of this, men will have different rights than women, but it’s probably an even amount of rights for men and women. for example, I could open a forum titled “if men and women are equal, how come a woman has complete rights to a child between a man and a woman?” As a woman, if you have sex with a man and get pregnant, only the woman has the choice as to what the baby’s fate will be. This includes whether or not to have an abortion, who gets to keep the child, and whether or not to put the baby up for adoption. Also, a woman can take a man to court for child support if she decides to keep the baby, regardless of what the man’s opinion on the baby is. But because this is a men’s rights issue, you will probably dismiss it as not being related to the subject. It is, but i just wanted to put it out there because many people think that men have many more rights than women do, which is completely false.

    • Number one, I’d like to thank you for making such asanine assumptions about me… next time I recommend actually reading the blog before you leap to conclusions about what I do or do not consider to be an important issue. I discuss men’s issues here as well and I am just as frustrated by the way that men are boxed into stereotypical roles as I am by the stifling of women’s rights and freedoms. See *definition of feminism* or read a book or two before you start running your mouth with no brakes.
      Whether or not women and men are “different” psychologically or physically has nothing to do with the fact that unequal rights for men and women is unjust. As far as a woman deciding whether or not to have an abortion, it’s obvious why this choice must be hers: it’s growing inside of her body and is literally a *part* of her body; to allow anyone to force someone else to make personal health decisions about their own bodies is simply wrong, period. However, I agree with you COMPLETELY that the mother of a child should not have the ability to financially rape a man just because he contributed to the child’s creation; since women currently have the legal right to an abortion, it is a woman’s responsibility to make decisions based on realistic evaluation of her capacity to support the child. If she allows herself to be dependent on someone else for the care and financial support of her child, she is clearly unfit to be a mother in my opinion. (I know I’m going to get shit for this, but this brutal truth is exactly why it’s so important to make sure decisions about abortion belong solely to the mother.)
      However, you’re kind of right about one thing: custody, child support and abortion rights are a bit off topic, since I was merely addressing the fact that we can’t remove our shirts in public without getting arrested. Yes, men’s and women’s rights are currently “different” but that doesn’t make it right to slap a woman with a criminal record just because it’s a hot day.

      • On the abortion issue, it’s not obvious why she should have the sole right to choose whether to have an abortion or not. Yes, it can be argued that it’s your body so your choice. However, it can also be argued that you agreed via your actions, in the event of pregnancy, to allow a man to ‘rent’ space in your body for his baby when you chose to have sex. I’m not saying that’s necessarily a good argument but it could still be argued just as easily as the ‘my body my choice’ argument.

        Then again I don’t think the ‘my body my choice’ argument is all that sound either. It can be easily argued that a woman agreed to assume the risk of pregnancy when she agreed to have sex since reproducing is the outcome that’s supposed to happen during sex. We have sex to reproduce. That’s why we feel the urge to do so. If we were asexual reproducers, sex wouldn’t be a physical urge every healthy adult feels.

        Now, if a woman got pregnant from eating an apple or something freaky like that I would agree it’s her choice since she never consented to an act that she knew could lead to pregnancy. However, men and women both know the act of sex can lead to pregnancy and agree to assume that risk when they chose to have sex.

        Finally, in case someone accuses me of it, no I’m not saying people should have sex just to reproduce. I know sex feels good and people enjoy it even if they don’t intend to become pregnant or impregnate someone. What I’m saying is that pregnancy is an inherent risk of sex, actually it’s the reason we have sex, and people assume that risk when they choose to engage in that act.

  13. I’m all for equality, but I personally think your argument is a bit naive. Assuming that breasts are not sexual would therefor imply that my touching a random woman’s clothed breast in public should not result in my being charged with sexual assault, much in the same way that a woman touching a man’s ‘breast’ would not result in any kind of sexual assault charges.
    But it would, and what better way to keep another person from doing something you don’t want them to than by covering it up?
    Also, if women’s breasts aren’t sexual, then why are they listed under the list of female erogenous zones? A woman can have great pleasure (and pain) from her nipples, much more so than a man in general (barring the use of things like nipple clamps) and so covering them up is just another way to protect them.
    Breasts are considered sexual primarily because they are formed when a girl “comes of age” and is normally a sign that that her body is ready to start having children. It’s probably a leftover from our caveman days when age wasn’t really counted and could possibly be discarded in modern civilization, but there are some biological things that never change.
    Let me ask you this: would you be happy for your 16y/o daughter (if you had one) to walk around topless? Wouldn’t taking photos in public with her in them be illegal? Would you then say that only 18+ are allowed to be topless? If you’re then forced into that kind of position it’s easier just to say that women, in general, should cover up their breasts.
    It’s so great that we live in a society where the most we have to complain about are a few small things that really only affect us at certain times of the year, unless you get the urge to go topless all year around!

    • GoddessBlue

      LOL. In response to your impression of my naivete, I’d like to say you’re the one who sounds utterly naive. For one thing, it is a FACT that both sexes’ nipples have an IDENTICAL range of sensitivity. For another thing, if you touch a woman’s thigh, it is considered a sexual assault as well. Are you saying it would be better to force women to cover their thighs at all times? No bathing suits, no shorts? The same vein of thinking has been around for centuries, my friend. Wake up. Either tits are banned from view or they’re not. Man tits or women tits, I advocate EQUALITY. In answer to your question, no I would not have a problem with my 16 year old daughter taking off her top on a hot day, just as I wouldn’t have a problem with my 16 year old son taking off his top on a hot day. With either a son or daughter however, I take exception only to those who touch or hurt my children or have a negative affect on them, not who’s attracted to them from afar or who snaps an anonymous pic of them with some cell phone camera. Someone’s personal excitement doesn’t do any damage to anyone, just as a man’s excitement over seeing my gorgeous feet in a pair of sexy heels doesn’t damage me, so long as he behaves himself. Ever since women were allowed out of long, parachute-like dresses, bloomers and so on, those who are attracted to women have been forced to suppress their naughty feelings and get on with things. Too bad. Aside from being mentally unstable, there is no reason men can’t evolve with the times, as they have throughout the centuries.
      And you’re right… it IS easier just to say that women in general should cover up their breasts. This article is not about ease, it’s about morality and justice. Oppression of women’s rights in favor of “easier” is immoral and unjust.

      • That’s perfectly fine, and, like I said, I’m ok with it provided the women who do take their tops off in public don’t then complain that men look at them for it. I hear the same complaints from women who dress overtly sexy and then complain that men are ogling them: if you’re going to dress (or not dress) in a way that is considered sexy or provocative by the masses, then expect people to notice.
        I can’t turn up wearing ultra tight clothing (at my weight, people are happy about that!) and not expect a few people to look, let alone stare. It’s rude, but we are in a multicultural cultural world and it’s ok to stare in some cultures.
        It might be considered natural to you and people you know, but so is sex, but I doubt you’d want to allow sex in public places.
        It might sound archaic to you, but a line has to be drawn somewhere. The line should be reviewed from time to time, but I’m sure if you polled people in public whether they deemed breasts to sexy, sexual and finally if they agreed that female toplessness should be legalised and, from that, you’d have your answer. Remember, it’s public sentiment the sways laws, so if you had enough people back you up then change could happen.
        Toplessness is allowed in France, but I’m sure if a woman walked into a supermarket topless they might react differently than if that same woman were on a beach.

  14. It’s actually been legal in certain provinces in Canada for quite some time now. It’s just the matter of getting America to follow (which they usually don’t, seeing how gay marriage still isn’t legal in the states).

  15. You said that being physically different shouldn’t matter, but were very quick to dismiss the abortion/child support argument because it is the woman who is pregnant and she has the right to decide what she does with her own body. However, it isn’t like the man has the option of taking the foetus into his own body. The woman has all rights when deciding what to do with a pregnancy because men and women are physically different.

    It’s also not simply about going topless; it’s about baring breasts. Simple fact: men do not have breasts. Their chests do not develop during puberty, so unlike breasts they are not related to sexual maturity.

    I’m not saying I disagree with you that women should be allowed to go topless; it’s just that if you keep denying that breasts are different from a man’s chest you’re never going to have a solid argument.

    • Being physically different on the outside should NOT matter. You are correct: the man does NOT have the option of taking the fetus into his own body. The facts are the facts are the facts and no matter how much you bitch about it, or how “unfair” it may be, the FACT is that a woman is the only one who can carry a child parasitically in her body. I know. The injustice. But it’s true. And SINCE it is part of her body and her body alone, it must be her decision whether or not to excise it from her body. This is just common sense. I mean, it’s not like a woman has the option to refuse a man’s sperm when he ejaculates inside of her, so if a wife no longer wants kids, she should be able to mandate her husband’s vasectomy, amirite?? Um… yeah, sounds slightly more irrational when you put it that way, donut? However, your claim that men don’t have tits is simply ridiculous and false. Exhibit A: Marvelous Man Boobs However, as you can see, not all women have breasts – Exhibit B: Tiava’s Flat Chested Girls – THIS IS A PORN SITE, DO NOT ENTER UNLESS YOU ARE AT LEAST 18 YEARS OF AGE BUT they are equally as arrested as other women who DO have tits for baring their chests in the open air.

      So as you can see, my argument is solid and based on logic… and the fact that your brain can’t absorb facts doesn’t change the validity of the argument; nor does it change the verifiable facts. Thanks for playing!!

      • To clarify, I was not suggesting that women should not have the right to decide what to do with a pregnancy, just pointing out that in some situations physical differences will always matter and you can’t ignore them.

        I also find it interesting that you think my brain can’t absorb facts when you are completely ignoring the facts that make ‘man-boobs’ different from a woman’s breasts. It is not a matter of size; as I already stated it is their relation to sexual maturity, a *fact* which you seem to have trouble absorbing.

      • So what you’re saying is that because tits are related to a woman’s maturity, that makes them somehow taboo?? Yeah, you’re right. I do have trouble absorbing a random attribution of impropriety to a body part due to its natural tendency to develop. Please clarify.

  16. Truly worthwhile post. Spend attention

  17. It is a pointless double-standard. I don’t know when I first started thinking this way, but it is almost sheer sexism to not allow women to bare so much as a nipple in places men can bare their chests. Am I a pervert? Somewhat, but I consider it also a matter of principle. I am well-aware that the lift on banning women’s toplessness would open the door for old saggy breasts, and I’m fine with that. I don’t have to look.

    • GoddessBlue

      HA! Agreed! I see saggy old-man breasts on the beach all the time, and I don’t ever think to myself: I wish I could call the cops! LOL Thank you for your comment 🙂

  18. I really love your blog.. Very nice colors & theme. Did you build this site
    yourself? Please reply back as I’m looking to create my own personal blog and would like to learn where you got this from or exactly what the theme is called. Many thanks!

  19. Men and women are not equal. Men are physically different from women. Women have acchieved civil equality, but the feminist attitude undermines that. Many women appreciate the traditional gender roles, though they are constantly pressured to hate that. Who’s standing up for the traditionalists?

    • GoddessBlue

      So… the feminist attitude of equality undermines equality? I think you’re confused.
      Also, feminists are the exact people FIGHTING for the RIGHT to be left alone about choosing to be a housewife. There are all kinds of “feminists”, even whacky ones, (just like Christians!) but the core message of feminism, per Bell Hooks and Gloria Steinem, our founding mothers, was that of CHOICE and the validation of ALL options.

  20. Because you cant seperate the words “how” and “come” in your title. Just kidding. I’m just doing research on gender inequality and quoting this in a presentation so I will probably never be back here again, but for some thought…is there such a thing as a masculinist? Someone who fights for equality for oppressed men? if you are interested in this issue and speaking out for equality rather then for one side or the other. here is some interesting stuff i have come across: men and women are abused about the same frequency: http://www.cdc.gov/ViolencePrevention/pdf/NISVS_Report2010-a.pdf and men DO get raped, about a third as often as women. Ruben here: http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/10pdf/09-5801.pdf

    may have been a criminal, but he was deported because his father needed to fulfill impossible requirements (10 years+more residency+ age requirements for men) for citizenship for the child, whereas a mother would have only had to be here a year. \
    Here is a ridiculous stereotypical disgusting generalized piece of work, favoring mothers and bashing dads:
    http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-scientific-fundamentalist/200806/why-are-mothers-better-parents-fathers-part-i
    . If people dont support abortion, its not ok for anyone for them, but for those that do, Only the mother gets a choice and the father has none. if a father wants the baby, too bad, the mother can legally kill his child and be supported. if the father makes the same decision, its jail time for murder. There is no difference between the 2 acts and yet: http://www.parentdish.co.uk/2013/09/24/jail-for-man-who-aborted-his-lovers-baby-with-pills-bought-online/
    . more womens violence: http://jezebel.com/5173723/the-double+standard-is-women-hitting-men-ever-okay
    .. and my favorite quote so far comes from: http://www.articlesaboutmen.com/2011/12/intimate-partner-violence-911/23820/
    where she says “Ironically, and unjustly, abused men today are where women were 60 years ago: their ill-treatment is ignored, trivialized or mocked; there are virtually no funded resources for them; and they are expected to suffer partner violence in silence. Which most of them do.”
    Also try to remeber reverse racism: giving people a pass for their horrible behavior because of the color of their skin, so you don’t seem racist. That is wrong. So is doing the same thing for gender. And chivalry=sexism. treating someone differently(good OR bad) because of their gender IS discrimination by definition. I leave you with a couple pictures: http://www.indizoom.com/2012/10/martin-luther-king.html#axzz2hkKUsITG

    http://hateandanger.wordpress.com/2013/05/04/100-organic-mix-loving-caring-sharing-kindness-understanding/

    http://gnosticwarrior.com/gandhi-quote-truth.html

    Also i understand there is STILL unfortunately discrimination against women but I dont think it should be handled one minor complaint against complaint. Gather ALL the evidence from ALL sides and throw the injustices in the supreme courts face. Not that it helped these women: http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/10pdf/10-277.pdf
    . Anyway, I hope you enjoy all this and can use it to help you fight for equality.

    • GoddessBlue

      Yeah, well we have to handle it bit by bit, since that’s how law works 😉
      I’m not sure where you’re going with the revere racism, but there’s no such thing; unfortunately, racism is an institutionally oppressive force; that’s why it’s not hurtful when someone calls a white person a “cracker” or “honky” – because those words are just not taken seriously in a society where Caucasians are the oppressive class. But that’s something you’d have to do research on yourself; sorry, I don’t have time to explain all of it in this comment, but I’m sure I’ll write bits about it here and there.
      Also, you keep saying “she agreed” to lie down and have sex which she *knew* would result in pregnancy… 1. We all make hasty/bad decisions. 2. Women don’t ALWAYS agree. 3. Young girls are raped every day who have no concept of how pregnancy is achieved. 4. Even older women can be clueless about the birds and the bees, thinking that a certain type of sex is safe… your argument just doesn’t hold water and there are many reasons why a woman *MUST* have the option of legal abortion; there are just too many variables. In my case, I had a miscarriage but it was not expelling itself naturally. Without legalized abortion, I would have had to wait until an infection set in to finally have a doctor intervene on my behalf to save me from death’s door. That’s ridiculous.
      And if we allowed men to be a part of the decision, a man could, out of spite, decide – based on his male rights to the pregnancy – that she has to carry his baby – and then leave her alone to care for it against her will. That’s pretty bullshit; I’m sorry, but you are a contributor to the pregnancy, YES… it is your baby, YES… but it’s STUCK in the female’s BODY. That is TERRIFYING, no matter who you are. And men don’t have a clue, and NEVER will, what it’s like to grow a living thing inside of you. Just like we will never know what it’s like to have a penis or a prostate.

  21. Well, I would want it to happen because it would be great. But if women walk around topless there would be more rapes and in schools kids would think it’ll be okay to touch other girls breast. Now, what you said was “Men are human too and are able to control their sexual urges, just as women are” But it’s harder for men to to control their urge ,because the normal range for men is 300 to 1200 ng/dL of blood and 30 to 95 ng/dL for women. Now the highest of the mens testostorone level is over 12x the amount of testostrone level in women and most of the time men rape women & women can also rape men but when a man rape a women they’re phyically sronger and can hold them down and force them, which is why I don’t think it’s not a good idea for the community ,but I won’t complain if it happens.

    • GoddessBlue

      1. You just described an equivalent ng/dL ratio and 2. We are all capable of self control. Men are not animals.

  22. Women’s breasts are not inherently sexual; they are sexualized by society. If women’s breasts become equalized (legalized and normalized) women can decide when to have them be taken into a sexual context. Obviously anyone can be attracted to anyone and we shouldn’t and can’t regulate someone’s attraction, but breasts will become like any other body part. Every body part can be an erogenous zone or merely a tool to function, depending on the context. Legs for example can be taken as sexual or not, depending on the persons perception. Girls developing breasts could go topless and it wouldn’t be taken as inherently sexual, merely a body part like any other. And for women to not be able to breastfeed because breasts are considered inherently sexual is appalling! Breastfeeding shouldn’t be sexualized just because it involves a breast, it’s a mother nurturing a baby, how perverted are people to perceive that as sexual? It comes down to that women can show all the plump parts of their breasts but can’t show the nipple, when men doesn’t have any plump parts but only the nipple. It doesn’t make sense, nipples are the same and for a kid to see a nipple isn’t inappropriate – kids have nipples themselves!

  23. Ummm women’s breast are considered sexual organs, and men’s pecs are not, no matter how “attractive” you find them.
    What I mean is that it would be EXACTLY as if men stuck their dicks out, men are naturally extremely attracted to breasts. as the indicate well or not well breeding.

    • GoddessBlue

      They are equally as sexual organs as men’s nips are. They are just sometimes bigger. Try sucking on a males nipples.

  24. I’m doing an article for the new york times and I would like to interview you

  25. Very well said.
    Equal rights are important, but this notion that males have more rigts are really narrow minded.
    On the topic of female toplessness being seen as illegal and sexist; I totally agree. It is just breasts ffs! Who ever wants to keep them sexualised its there problem. One thing I do know however is that a lot of people would lose a lot of money if we gradually or suddenly stop paying to see them.

  26. I personally think both men and women should cover up. As a man I feel like women actually have MORE rights rather than less. If a woman stares at a topless man in a sexual way it’s perfectly fine but if a man stares at a woman’s breasts even while they’re covered up he’s some how a pervert and can be charged with the crime of sexual harassment. Something a woman would never be charged with for doing the same damn thing to a man. If a woman touches a man’s chest, again she can do whatever the hell she wants and we’re not even allowed to complain. However if a man does the same thing to her we would get slapped and arrested for molesting her even though she did the same thing to us. My ex girlfriend keeps touching my chest even though I have asked her multiple times not to touch me there since we’re not dating anymore. She still does it anyway and acts like it’s no big deal but then gets mad at me when I touch her breasts. If it’s OK for her to touch my chest whenever she feels like it then I should be able to do the same to her. I wouldn’t mind her touching me if we were still dating but I don’t think it’s fair that she can continue to touch me any way she wants when I can’t do the same. Children don’t even look any different and when asked about why girls need to cover up when boys don’t even though they both look exactly the same the answer is usually, because girls grow breasts. So boys grow hair. Do you know how disgusting it is to walk around a beach surrounded by topless men? About as disgusting at it would be to walk around a bunch of men with their dicks hanging out. Women are obviously just as sexually attracted to topless men as men are to topless women so there’s no reason why one should be treated as more sexual than the other and I think it’s a lie to say it’s not sexual at all or that it’s only deemed sexual because they’re covered up. Men aren’t covered but are still sexually attractive to women. Almost every sitcom has an episode where a woman intentionally spills something on a guy’s shirt trying to make it seem like an accident just to get him to take his shirt off, why would she go to so much trouble to see him topless if she wasn’t sexually attracted to it? And again, if a guy did that, even accidentally, he would just get slapped. And guys never do it on purpose because we know girls aren’t going to just casually take their shirts off in front of us so there’s no reason for us to even try that trick. If men supposedly have more or equal rights to women, why is it only men who get in trouble for wanting to see and/or touch a woman’s breasts? Why are women allowed to touch see and touch us without any consequences? I might be the only guy that feels this way but still it shouldn’t matter what gender I am, if I don’t want to be touched women should respect that and I should be able to swim with my shirt on without being harassed by everyone to take it off. The law doesn’t even consider that harassment because I’m a man but it feels like harassment to me. There’s no law or reason I should have to take my shirt off and if there was I would say the same should apply to women. But there is a law saying women need to be covered and the same should apply to men. I’ll take my shirt off in public when women start going topless in public. Ladies, if you touch my chest without my permission, you better not complain when I touch your breasts without your permission. You want things to be equal right? So if you don’t want guys randomly grabbing your boobs, don’t do it to them otherwise you better be OK with it.

  27. You clearly did not do any research before writing such a feministic rant about a topic that is so illogical that even most of your supporters would not care to fight for. Female breasts ARE inherently sexual (ever engaged in sexual activity before? Females enjoy sexual stimulation of the breasts, not men), bikinis DO create a greater risk for assault, #5 is self defeating…. Yikes just do your research

  28. This is bull girls should be able to have it out and if guys stare they are perverts and it would be THIER fault if they have a car crash and we wouldn’t be fully naked and the correct term is breast and penis and if breast are sexual then why do babies suck on them? We should have equal rights it’s stupid and girls aren’t weak we are stronger than some guys. Geeze when will humanity be right?

  29. Related to #4….
    If a woman was walking around topless and gets groped, is the perp charged with sexual assault or just assault?
    If it’s sexual assault, wouldn’t that make breasts sexual, hence the narrative about legality would change? What if you touch a topless man on the chest? Can he file a sexual assault claim?

    • GoddessBlue

      Yes the man can currently file a sexual assault claim if his chest is fondled…. So I’m not sure where you are going with this

  1. Pingback: FEMALE BREASTS ARE NOT INHERENTLY “SEXUAL” | TheEmpris

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